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Date: December 28, 2001 To: The Hunting Report From: John Roush RE: Complaint on Don Ayers Outfitters
Regarding SCI member outfitter Don Ayers, of Alberta, Canada, I wish to enter a vigorous complaint of ethic violations.
I booked a five day hunt in November of 2001, upon being assured that I would probably bag a record book whitetail buck. The literature provided stated I would be staying in "a modern style farmhouse with downstairs bedrooms to lodging in heated rustic log cabins. Great meals (another lie) are prepared and served by our outstanding cooks (another lie). In some areas we house our clients at a hotel or motel with a restaurant. We supply all meals and rooms."
Actually, I was taken to an unfinished country house and shown an alcove on the basement cement floor with a bunk bed. To enter one had to cross several lengths of planks suspended over a mudhole, the only entrance. There was no walkway, one crossed a shaded, slippery hillside, a dangerous situation in an area prone to ice and snow, especially so for a 78 year old man. In our area the authorities would not have permitted habitation in such a case. Not to have a private room while the "guide" had one seemed incongruous. While I was out someone or something went through my things, and scattered some about. In the evening, I asked them to turn off the noisy washer and driers adjacent to my alcove when I wanted to retire - no privacy - but they continued irrespective and again the second evening. I left the second day. Conditions afforded were deplorable.
In his surly rebuttal letter of Dec. undated, Ayers denies that his contract specifies a private room, but his lie is refuted by the language quoted, shown in the enclosed paper he provided me beforehand. If I had thought that I would be treated so badly, being put into deplorable conditions, having been asked to pay over $700 u.s. per day, I would never had contracted to go on his "Hunt".
Actually it was not a legitimate hunt. It proved to be a fools errand. I was the victim of a scam, with no chance whatsoever of bagging a decent buck.
Consider that I have had 66 years of experience hunting deer, having shot about 139 and have written 3 books on hunting. I have a lot of experience and respect for WT bucks. To think that a cagy buck would saunter out in front of zebra (black and white) painted outhouses standing stark against green and brown is incredible. Writers all agree that blinds should blend in with the environment and should be emplaced weeks earlier.
Those few doe deer I saw on the one morning showed immediate apprehension several hundred yards away, raised their flags and took off. I told him his scheme might work with snow on the ground, inclement weather and the rut operational, after the huts had been in place for quite some time, however, I could visualize no possibility of success in the conditions present, the rut being weeks away, with the outhouses in place only a few days and such a conspicuous eyesore on the terrain. Other hunters I have spoken to thought it highly ridiculous to think a buck would make himself vulnerable in sight of that eyesore. Thus I considered termination.
I had the impression, in talking with Don Ayers in person before booking the hunt, that he was going to guide me. Instead, he turned me over to a dogmatic, opinionated young slob. I feel that I was not given any guide service, only a chauffeur's ride to a conspicuous outhouse - certainly not what I would call a proper hunt. The young man refused to consider using any other tactics. He did not want me to rattle antlers. Ayers tells a number of lies in his rebuttal. I asked the "guide" when he wanted to go out - I was ready - and when he was to come and get me. He set the times. This refutes par 4, page 2 of Ayers' surly letter. In par. 5, I did not complain about not hunting on Sunday. When he told me that there was no hunting on Sun. I asked if they went to church, thinking I would go with them. They replied "No." That was the extent of the conversation. He says his was an "a quality hunt". I cannot believe that you could find any experienced hunter who would agree, considering the circumstances which I have truly reported.
I have been put to out-of-pocket expense in this fool's errand to the extent of approximately $3,000. I think it outrageous to be brought out so far away, at considerable expense, and so much wasted energy in travels, on a wild goose chase. Apparently none of Ayers hunters took a buck this past November, otherwise he would have bragged about it in his feeble attempt to ridicule my legitimate complaint. I asked Ayers to reimburse me those monies I paid in advance to him ($1,915.00 U.S.), however you will note in his surly letter that he refuses completely.
Let no one think I might be an inadequate hunter. Proceeding on to Nebraska in the second week, in a real hunt over a large area, not a passive sitting in a garish outhouse, I tagged three deer, during each of three successive mornings. All were one shot kills. The first two at 200 and over 400 yards. The largest I rattled in was closer, a 5x6 WT that will score adequately for the record book.
May I ask you to make demand upon him to reimburse those sums since he did not provide: quarters represented, a reasonable opportunity to bag a fine buck, as he promised.
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Date: March 26, 2002 To: APOS From: John Roush RE: Complaint on Don Ayers Outfitters I have read your letter of March 17 and enclosures carefully. Material false statements are made in Mr. Ayers letter:
1. His literature clearly states that a room will be provided.
2. In his number 2 paragraph, there was no snow or ice cover on the ground in the area his man took me to. It would be easy for you to substantiate the false statements by referring to the newspapers of the day. During the period of time I was there in Alberta, Nov. 2-3, 2001, the weather was warm, unusually so, much like the weather of California at the time. There was no snow or ice on the ground, and no hindrance to stalking or rattling. With their winter coats, the deer would not be moving about in mid-day.
3. His par. 3, I asked his man when he wanted to go out and when he wanted to pick me up. He made the selections, and I was ready. I have a lot of patience, but little for fraudulent misrepresentation.
4. His par 5, there was a real hazard, in the only entrance to the house being across two lengths of planks, high over a mud hole. In this area authorities would not have permitted occupancy in such conditions.
5. In his par. 6, it was my clear understanding that Don Ayers would be guiding me, with his assurance that he would put me into a situation where I had a high probability of bagging a trophy whitetail buck. Instead I was victim of a wild goose chase, with no likelihood of getting any shot at any sort of buck.
6. In his par. 7, anyone knowledgeable about cooking venison does not cook it excessively so that it becomes like shoe leather. The lie is clear; there was nothing resembling "gourmet cooking".
7. His par. 8, the opinion of mine was generated early and substantiated by the abysmal treatment, and the coarse disregard of anything resembling companionship and hospitality.
To digress a moment, in the past season I tagged seven deer, 2 blacktail in CA, two WT and one Mule deer in NE, one 30" mule deer and a 4x4 Coues deer in Sonora. I applied for tags in WY and NV without being drawn. I have hunted with more than fifty outfitters and never had complaints such as this. Most outfitters, and your members I am certain, are ethical and straightforward.
There is an element of fraud in this situation. To expect one to have shooting from a garish black and white painted outhouse in the middle of a green and brown field, (there was no snow, and the rut had not commenced) is ridiculous. It can be compared to the fraternity initiation rite of taking a man out to seek jacksnipe in the dark with an open hand held sack. The outhouses had only been emplaced a few days prior to my arrival. All authorities suggest blinds should blend in with the environment and should be emplaced well before use. All experienced hunters to whom I have talked concur that it is utterly ridiculous to put an experienced hunter into such a flagrantly impossible situation.
Apparently none of his hunters bagged a deer that season. If they had he surely would have pointed that out. They were entirely unreceptive to any consideration of alternative tactics that I wished to suggest arising out of a wealth of hunting experience over the past 67 years.
In line with your announced policy of seeing that members conduct their business operation in a professional and ethical manner, I ask that you require that Don Ayers refund the monies paid to him by me US $1,667.00. Actually I have been put to expenses aggregating approximately three thousand dollars, and I lost a week of my valuable time in this wild goose chase through his misrepresentations.
You have my earlier letters with details, which I certify to be true and correct.
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Date: April 22, 2002 To: John Roush From: APOS RE: Complaint on Don Ayers Outfitters
The Discipline Committee of the Alberta Professional Outfitters Society met in April 2002 to review the information you provided in your complaint against Don Ayers Outfitters and the rebuttal documentation provided by Mr. Ayers.
The Discipline Committee found that it was extremely difficult to establish clear and indisputable evidence upon which to base a firm and defensible judgment in favor of either of the two parties in this matter. As an example, your complaint refers to "deplorable conditions" as sleeping quarters - the rebuttal describes, "carpeted living area with bunk beds, couch, chairs . . . TV and satellite system"; your complaint refers to poor food; Mr. Ayers describes "steak dinner". This type of contradictory information is provided throughout the complaint and rebuttal documentation making it impossible to favor either side of this dispute. Mr. Ayers advises in his rebuttal that he offered you "half of (your) money back" when you advised him of your decision to depart early from the hunt and this was felt to be an appropriate compensatory offer.
The Discipline Committee ruled that there is insufficient cause to order Mr. Ayers to provide any further compensation for your unsatisfactory hunt; however, the Committee has placed your complaint on Mr. Ayers' APOS file for consideration in the event that there are any further similar complaints against him and has cautioned Mr. Ayers that he is expected, as an APOS member, to provide professional and courteous service to his clients. The Discipline Committee would also like to suggest to you that you conduct a careful and thorough research of the operations of an outfitter with whom you are considering a hunt to ensure that he can provide the type of service you wish to enjoy during your visit.
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To: Apos From: Don Ayers Outfitters RE: Compliant filed by John Roush We want to thank you for the opportunity to answer to the allegations of a bad hunt that Col. John H. Roush, Jr. D.B.A. has sent to you in regards to a hunt that we attempted to supply him with, in November past.
Mr. Roush has supplied you with a copy of our letter of rebuttal to him but he was not satisfied with that and has decided to carry it further, we expected this and we are offering the following points in our defense. We want to point out a lot of the things that Mr. Roush is complaining about but they are not right.
1. Mr. Roush states that he booked a 5 day hunt for $3750.00 but in fact our receipt and signed contract shows that he booked a 6 day hunt from Nov. 1 to 8, 2001, for $3250.00. You will also find on the top of United Airlines itinerary dated June 22,2001 that he has noted the" Change in schedule here looking forward to trip" this is not our doing.
2. Mr. Roush wanted to try different methods of hunting instead of sitting in "a zebra striped out house" of which he admits to have seen deer from. He wanted to try rattling but he fails to mention that we had a 1&1/2 inches of crusted or iced cover snow on the ground in all shaded areas which made walking and rattling out of the question. We took in to consideration his age (78) ability to walk quietly and his safety, the conditions were not right for rattling.
3. Under 'methods of hunting' in our literature it states that this is "all day hunting "the only time that was stipulated to him was the departure from the farm house in the morning to allow sufficient time to get to the hunting area. Mr. Roush then informed the guide what time he would like to be picked up so that he could return to the farm house for a hot lunch and rest period. Mr. Roush demonstrated to us that he had very little patience when he only wanted to hunt a couple of hours in the morning and the same in the afternoon.
4. Mr. Roush's room was not an alcove but instead a finished basement complete with carpeted living area with bunk beds, couch, and chairs, he was not promised. a private room. As well as a TV and satellite system. We have used this house and basement for the past 6 years and Gordon Utri used it before us.
5. The entrance to the house was under a remodeling but it was in no way a safety hazard to enter or leave, the planks were all 4X12's and very sturdy.
6. In all of our correspondence or verbally Don did not say that he was going to be his guide he was not in Don' s guiding area.
7. In retrospect to Mr. Roush's opinions of what constitutes good home cooked meals by outstanding cooks, he had stated that this was "a lie". We have employed Theresa Chamberlain for the past 5 years and have never had a complaint about her cooking until Mr. Roush complained about his steak being over cooked, at least he was getting a steak dinner.
8. We believe that Mr. Roush's opinion of Tuffy as to being a "dogmatic, opinionated young slob" was formed after he was informed of his alternatives of either staying or going home. When his decision was to leave we in good faith thought it only fair to offer him one half his money back, which we did.
In closing we feel that in no way had we misrepresented our operation in any form. Mr. Roush was shown every consideration that is possible by any outfitter. As we have stated in our literature we believe that through our efforts as well as effort from our clients we can provide a very successful hunt. We feel that our success is in not only bagging an animal but also enjoying our clients company, Mr. Roush afforded us the chance do neither.
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To: John Roush From: Don Ayers Outfitter RE: Complaint by John Roush
I really like the way that you start your letter, "where I had real hunting, bagging deer each of the first three morning. One buck I rattled in was a 6X5 NT WT that scores well", that tells me that you are into killing and not hunting. With us you booked a trophy hunt and trophy bucks don't follow there moms around coming to any call or rattle. I have a couple of questions for you, first how small was the first 2 bucks and why didn't you give us the green score on the 6X5? Will he go into the high what?
I am not going to get into this with you but I will answer some of the allegations of all the wrong things on such a terrible whitetail hunt.
No one went through your bags, and you knew about the dog, so would it have been a lot of trouble for you to zip them shut a little. I will tell you, no other client had a problem with a dog scattering their items around.
It doesn't say in our contract that you will get a private room at the farm house in fact the hunters always share the common area, and at the time of your hunt you were the only hunter in that section of the basement. If we were to put you up at a motel you would have had to share a room with another hunter. The entrance to the farmhouse was not as dangerous as you would like people to believe as the owner was in the middle of some renovations. What do you do when you get to a hotel that is under renovation, do you walk on the wood provided or demand a different entrance? If you would have stayed until Sunday afternoon the entrance way was completed.
I assure you sir that you are totally wrong about your theory on the zebra painted outhouse, as you prefer to call them. On November 16, 2001 Les Russell my guide and myself set out a zebra painted outhouse in a new area with no snow. At approximately 11:30 on November 17, 2001 Bob Matyas from Lower Nazareth, P A shot at and maybe wounded what he considered a trophy buck, something in the 140 to 150 point class buck.
What do you think we do with the cloth blinds, leave them out for months ahead so that they can really get weathered. No, rather we put them out when we are scouting and find a spot or carry them in when we are taking a hunter to a different spot, set them up and put the hunter in them.
I am sending you a copy of all of our e-mails and nowhere in them do I say that I am going to guide you. I guide in a different area where we rent a Log cabin with an outside out house and a portable shower that we set up every other day so that the clients can shower. You sure would not have liked that camp.
The names that you call my partner and (son) are just your opinion as he has a long line of returning clients. I don't know how your personalities clashed so bad but they did and you could not find anything that was to your satisfaction on this hunt.
You can be assured sir that had you been hunting with me you would have been driven to a blind and expected to sit there all day as this is what blind hunting is all about. Instead you only wanted to hunt the first couple of hours in the morning and the last 2 hours in the evening. This is not hunting, this is thinking you know more then anyone else about hunting, as you only wanted to hunt the peek movement hours, and that does not fly with us. This is the pre rut time and bucks can move at anytime.
You complained about not being able to hunt on Sunday, why did you think you were booked from the 2 to the 8 of November to do a 6 day hunt, please count those days. You complained that Theresa over cooked your steak on Friday night. In your eyes there was nothing about this hunt that was right, so I take you back to your statement that because you were not "bagging a buck a day", this was a terrible hunt. We are not into just killing, we are into a quality hunting experience with a good chance at getting a trophy.
Please find enclosed copies of our e-mails, SCI hunting reports and a letter of reference on Tuffy, my son. I will stand before any organization and defend our actions on this hunt.
In closing I must state that you were given the choice, we would keep your check for 1/2 of the hunt and you would stay or we would give you back your check and you could leave right away, it was your choice to take the check and run. This letter is sent without prejudice and we will not be sending any money later.
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